Some Sum3D troubles

Discussion in 'CAM software' started by mpl, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. mpl

    mpl Member

    First of all, sorry if my questions are noobie-like. I have a good experience with hyperDent (strategies, custom scripting stuff), but some time ago we switched to Sum3D for multiple machines.
    I`m pretty frustrated by count of bugs, no responding, unexpected things from almost any side of this CAM software (hyperDent also have bugs but way less).

    Here are some questions
    1) mechanism of "replace" stuff. What is exact requements for this? What I dig so far is:
    "<REPLACE>" operation (when execute strategy it goes unmarked like "//<REPLACE>", if I just do 'New operation>Rename to "<REPLACE>")
    "<REPLACE>" in postprocessed file name and remark
    related mapping (I tried just make copy to, made a copy in replace.txt, select related interface when loading part: as a result - Sum still take 00-339 strategy tools and operations!)​
    2) How to print all parts in related disk? I can only print single (current) part.
    3) Is that right - if I add '<T:/some_tool/some_material>' to operation name, it take some_tool whatever tool is currently placed in tool parameters?
    4) Is there a way to change reduce connector percent value related to connector diameter (not an absolute cut depth)?
    5) difference beetween machining configurations (.cfg), Cam (.cam) and CfgCam (.cfg,.cam) on binary level?
    6) Is there a possibility to read/edit strategy in human readable format?
    7) How to say Sum to autodetect occlusial side screwchannel only by first axis (skip cavity screwchannel axis and conical screwfit area if exists)?

  2. DMC

    DMC Scott Hudson

    Replace is for implant geometry to use your own custom library. It is very advanced and usually extra money.

    We do not have any bugs. We report them and cimsystem has fixed them a long time ago for us. Like 5 years without a bug.
    cadfan likes this.
  3. cadfan

    cadfan Moderator Staff Member

    to be honest so many questions maybe time for a lesson or a longer teamviewer session with your reseller.
    Codfish Joe likes this.
  4. mpl

    mpl Member

    Sorry, but I really get Sum3D dropouts (I call it a "bug") pretty often. However, I can live with it (maybe it is because we use 2016 licence).
    I don`t ask how to build/use library. I have library stuff already, it IS working for old factory strategies, but when I just put new "<REPLACE>" operation to new strategy, it doesn`t take replace library. In that case I suppose there is some magic code to say sum3d "this operation is for replace" or other undocumented additional actions from end user, which are pretty hard to explore on intuitive level.

    That makes sence, thanks. Didn`t expect I need things like that for such basic questions though (it was pretty intuitive with hyperDent even a lot of things were limited in case of strategy editing/creating).
  5. cadfan

    cadfan Moderator Staff Member

    in hyperdent you can do nothing without template gen thats the big difference and he cost a few dollar exactly 5000 just the generator !!!! and generator is your insurance !! no gen no insurance exept simulation. and if you have a 2016 license constr. info is maybe your problem now its 2018 try STL only seperated from constr info by the way same in hyper just oposite without constr. info stupid like a peace of butter.
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
  6. Codfish Joe

    Codfish Joe Administrator Staff Member

    I'm still not sure I completely understand your problem. However, your .cam file needs to match up with the number in the .txt file.
    If you are trying to make copy for different operations to machine. You will need to change the curve name so the cam file is not looking for the old file.
    6,"NOBEL ACTIVE RP","nobactrp",3.4,1,3,2
    cadfan and Kvonn3gut like this.
  7. mpl

    mpl Member

    Yep, tried and it works, thank you very much!
    But still can`t insert from scratch <REPLACE> function, here how I try to do it:

    (not sure Machining type and postprocessor file name is necessary, I did it because in factory strategy it was desighned this way)
  8. DMC

    DMC Scott Hudson

    @Codfish Joe

    Brad will help you.

    teamviewer is probably best.

    Send your numbers to brad (at) 3d-dental d0t c0m
  9. mpl

    mpl Member

    Thanks, DMC, emailed to Brad.

    When I said "hyperdent was limited to edit strategies" I meant I had FULL licence with all modules, and anyway I programmed some stuff for manipulating CAM data statistics, getting CNC machines state in real time based on CAM data + machine logs + custom software installed on machines, checking/modificating output G-Code (yes, in a scriptable way!) for have everything working in a fully automatic fashion.
    cadfan likes this.
  10. Codfish Joe

    Codfish Joe Administrator Staff Member

    <REPLACE> is not an actual operation that does anything. It is simply a command that then references your Sum3D>Replace folder on your computer
  11. Codfish Joe

    Codfish Joe Administrator Staff Member

    <REPLACE> will always have a // in front
  12. mpl

    mpl Member

    Only when you appliyng strategy sequence.
    Brad can`t help unfortunately. He said something wrong with .cfg (I guess on binary level, there is no way to edit the file manually like convert to xml and back).

    I attached strategy I did so maybe someone can help with it.

    Steps to reproduce:
    1) create new operation or copy from existent
    2) rename to <REPLACE>
    3) apply to file

    Result: nothing attached after <REPLACE>.
    Expected: if you have replace interfaces, Sum3D will grab connected operations

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  13. mpl

    mpl Member

    It was an error in cfg file on binary level. Nothing to do with that.

    Built strategy from blank + imported/modified some jobs from working strategy.
    Thanks anyone for help.
    cadfan and 2thm8kr like this.
  14. Gianmarco Caramelli

    Gianmarco Caramelli CAM Engineer Staff Member

    hi guys,
    making/managing SUM3D strategies is not something you can do without a dedicated advanced training.
    First you must know how SUM3D works, then in case you can do that.
    I suggest to contact first your cam dealer about training. In case after that we can help you all.
    biodentg and DMC like this.
  15. biodentg

    biodentg Well-Known Member

    Good to have you here Geanmarco, I have another question for you or anybody's opinion here.
    I already own Sum3D from CAP/HS a locked version for my 3 Roland DWX50 mills.
    I'm in the market for a new Roland DWX52D.
    What is my best option to integrate CAM for the mill?
    Should I add the mill to my already owned locked ver Sum3D ? difficult since I not buying from same source.
    Or should I look for a lighter ver. millbox option included with the mill purchase by some resellers?
    Thank you
  16. Gianmarco Caramelli

    Gianmarco Caramelli CAM Engineer Staff Member

    in case you'll not buy machine from CAP/HS your actual locked SUM3D will remain as it is.
    Or you can buy machine from CAP/HS and at same time upgrade your cam to Millbox by adding the 3 DWX50 mills too.

    If you buy the machine from other reseller hope you'll choose Millbox and not other cam solutions! ))))
    I say Millbox and not SUM3D because now all "our" Roland dealers are giving Millbox. SUM3D is now the "expert" option (called Millbox Expert).

    In my opinion now all users should work with Millbox interface... definitely more easy-to-use, more user frinedly, faster.
    And in case of an "expert job managment"'s need, of course SUM3D (ops, Millbox Expert) will help, as always.
    AGV, leshi, cadfan and 2 others like this.
  17. manaf

    manaf New Member

    Hi friends
    I want to modify Millbox roughing tool diameter from 2 to 2.5 mm.
    How I can to do it?
  18. DMC

    DMC Scott Hudson

    For what material and restoration type?

    That needs to be defined also

    Then, adjust feedrate and rpm for that material of course in tool parameters for your new tool.
  19. DMC

    DMC Scott Hudson

    Ask your reseller, or we can help for a small fee.
  20. mpl

    mpl Member

    As you see, standart answer in "ask your reseller for training for $$$". Awful, I know.

    Since CIMSysytem doesn`t proveide any proper readable documentation for software they sold for $5000, here is an answer from engineer to engineer:

    1. Millbox is only interface for Sum3D core. Everything related to calculation (blanks, holders, toolroom, layers, curves etc) is in Sum3D. Millbox can only use/manipulate its features in various ways, not adding new ones. Although sometimes it does provide new features, which are (again) actually scripting around sum3d core, and can be done in sum3d with huge pain, because of cluttered interface, which is because sum3d was less dental-oriented software in the past.
    2. So go to Sum3D (directory level up from millbox, open camwinc.exe)

    Then, everything depends on strategy design. Open you strategy as usual project (depending on configuration it can be in some random folder, see settings for path). Make backup before ANY changes!!! There is NO undo, so any changes you make goes straight to you strategy!
    3a. If the tool is "hardcoded" in your strategy (there is no <T:...> like codes in operation name), just change it inside tool parameters.

    3b. If strategy has something like <T:...> in operation name, that means strategy hold only REFERENCE for tool. It take tool parameters from tool room, where everything sorted by machine, material and some other categories.
    3b1. Go to utility / toolroom. This is your tools. You have to find which tool strategy takes from this list (often it is sorted by machine type/name) and modify it. Sometimes tool name can hold something like "-zr" in the strategy. That means, if there is something like "<T:D3xB-?>" in your strategy, that means - your strategy takes "D3xB-zr" tool IF current material is zirconia.

Share This Page